A smoke-free Ireland
Anne, Louise is correct about the "anti Brigade". I know lots of smokers and ex smokers. The vast majority of the latter party are tolerant of smokers. There is a very small proportion of ex smokers, a lot of whom appear on this site, who come across as smug, arrogant and condescending and feel they are morally superior because they quit (at least that's how there posts come across). They like to lecture about the dangers of smoking and they basically put themselves on a pedestal. If anything they should be tolerant and understanding of addiction. My own father is one.
It would be laughable if it wasn't so pathetic.
Have I told you lately how grateful I am for all your help in making sure that I didn't let my decision to quit smoking in 2001 turn me into a sanctimonious, judgemental control freak with a bad habit on trying to manipulate other people?
If not I am telling you now...
...and Louise, don't worry...honestly, truly, I was scared myself that I would spent the rest of my life craving a smoke, but the urge DOES go away...
You just weren't ready last time is all...
Good luck when you are...
You do realise your reaction to Kieran's posting is stress and
guilt-driven. Underneath that thin veneer you wish you had
never taken that first cigarette because you wouldn't be in
this position now, meaning fear of getting cancer, spending
money and then blowing it up in smoke and finally aggro
from the ones who managed to quit, you must feel awful
and I feel for you!
I used to smoke....it must have taken a dozen attempts to quit. I still do not know how I made it.
It's great not to have to smoke & great that it's been moved outside. Given that, I can understand it's an addictive habit that some cannot or do not care to quit....it's been moved outside & hopefully away from the door. I understand the smokers are not the bad guys. They're just hooked.
I gave up cigarettes and I am more relaxed now that I don't have to think of an excuse to leave office to have a smoke.
If Ireland was totally smoke free, life would be ideal.
Smokers are, they say, a minority. All through this discussion, smokers have mentioned that and brought it up as relevent. They feel persecuted, many of them say.
This is important. Minority groups can often feel as if the majority is sitting on them. And that feeling matters: it affects the way the minority and the majority interact, and what allowances they make for each other. Note, though, that it is the *feeling* which matters, not the actual satistics. It matters not that smokers *are* a minority; it matters rather that they *feel like* a minority. And well they may: they are constantly bombarded with advertisements on how to quit the filthy habit, and are subjected, they tell us, to the disaproving glares and comments of the non-smoking majority.
I mention this because I want to make a point. Non-smokers also may *feel* that they are in a minority. I know I did, when I was in college. I have no idea how many students smoked, but I know that anywhere there was a gathering of students out-of-doors, there would be at least one smoker. And, given that even the most ardent, the most addicted puffer doesn't smoke *all the time*, that adds up to quite a lot of smokers. And I want to remind you, in case you've forgotten, that one smoker is quite capable of oppressing an entire roomful of non-smokers. What the place would have felt like had smoking been permitted in the canteen I shudder to think.
What I'm trying to get at here is that we have a debate between two groups both of whom feel like oppressed minorities, whatever the statistical facts may be. Both groups look at the other with suspicion and mistrust. Both accuse the other of being high-handed and of wishing to impose their standards on everyone else. In such a situation, feelings are bound to run high.
Please forgive me if I have in any way added to the conflagration.
(There has been a slight amount of topic drift, and this conversation is now focussing on smokers and ex-smokers advising each other on how to give up. This new topic has at least *some* hope of being a productive conversation. Keep it up. And I'll not butt in again in a place where, having no experience to offer, I can't be helpful.)
Benzene is a carcingen. And quite volatile. If it's in cigarettes they're dangerous even when they aren't being burned. I'll make a mental note not to work on a counter selling the things, with a stack of boxes of 'em beside me. Benzene really is foul.
Methenal (formaldehyde), the simplest aldehyde, is another organic solvent. I don't think it's a carcinogen, as far as i remember, but, like all organic solvents, it's very bad for the lungs. It's lighter than benzene, but also more polar, so may be less volatile. (Polar things stick together better, and so evaporate less.) Still, it's volatile enough, and is another good reason to avoid even unlit cigarettes.
Methanol, the simplest alcohol, is another volatile organic solvent. (There are lots of alcohols, including colesterol: it's a class of chemicals. The one in drinks is ethanol, the second simplest. It's toxic. Methanol is deadly.)
Acetylene. D'you know, it's too long since I left college. I can think of nothing to say about acetylene.
Ammonia is another nasty one. Aside from anything else, it stinks to high heaven. And it's hardly healthy.
What are all these things doing in cigarettes anyway?
Why have the US government approved 599 additives for use in the manufacture of cigarettes - some of the chemicals include cyanide, benzene, formaldehyde, methanol (wood alcohol), acetylene (the fuel used in torches), and ammonia.
Been off the site for a while but I'm delighted to see that it is now a serious discussion forum for those of us who are struggeling with nicotine addiction. Spent some time getting rid of pietious, self-regarding anti-smokers and happy to have had some success. Lets hack on (no pun intended) and see if our thoghts can help one another. If anybody finds the site helpful pls let us know.
I am a smoker who regreats ever starting .
However why has no one ever suggested not driving a motor vehicle .
sure you can now sit in a pub or orther building including your work and breathe fresh air
get away with you you are breathing a mixture of lead carbon dioxide and other pollutants from the motor vehicles driving past . there are 22 pollutants released from the burning of petroloum products .
suerly it is now time to stop the motor vehicle
Home heating oil parrafin is also a pollutant so is it not now tme to stop heating your homes .
this deabte has focused on smoking which i agree as a smoker is a filthy habt and one that is hard to break believe you me i have tried . When smoking is made illegal perhaps then we can go after the global warming and highly polluting car van truck and bus which does more harm to anyones health than secondry smoking could ever do .
Smog does come ou off the end off a cigarette . but is a by product off fog getting attached to pollution
So pleae tell me folks how can you say you are healthier just because you force a smoking ban on people but do not have the same determination to force the removal off all internal combustion engined vehicles from your town village or small hamlet
i live in the town of omagh and would never think off bringing my car running on non polluting bio-fuel into the town . i am permantaly surround by a fog of diesel and petrol fumes .
I do not use this as an excuse for being a smoker . however it is time i feel to put smoking into context on wider field of debate
Look foward to hearing your views
Thank you! I never heard of NicoBloc! Amazing when I thought I'd heard of everything. I am going to check this out. One thing I'll never do is stop trying. I love not smoking, hate that I smoke, but am surely addicted badly to them. Thanks again.
Smoking is an addiction - nicotine is more addictive than crack cocaine.
I don't believe its about choice, whether someone wants to quit or not. Nicotine does things to you brain that you can't rationalise.
As a smoker all my life I know how the addiction works.
How can you rationalise putting pieces of leaf into a rolled up piece of paper and lighting it, and paying through the nose for the pleasure of doing it.
If its about choice why not put pieces of oak leaf into paper and light it - you'd quit that quit enough. It's an addiction and should be treated as one.
Then there is disapproval. This is not a message to the dangers of smoking but is a personal attack and is always taken up as one. People tend to be at arm length with the likes of these people and will tend to smoke just to annoy them.
The advertising market with regards to smoking is only something to laugh at. For such a serious matter there should be no laughter of this kind. After all none of us laugh at the advertisement on accidents on the road and while they don't completely stop accidents they have definatly made hundreds and thousands of people more careful on the road. I believe that they have prevented many of them.
The anti-smoking message needs to be the same. Hitting the pocket is definately the way to go or hitting future job prospects, future education and sports. What could be without cigarettes in the future would fire the imagination of people and get them to dream and aim for goals in life more than anything else.
Showing up choking patients makes a smoker feel guilty and is counterproductive. One tends to go off and say, "Ah, what the heck. I only live once. I can't be worrying about these things!" Rooms full of smoke are usually shown up exaggerated and people know that it is not like this when they go out. Pharmeuceutical companies show up the cigarette as being funny and everyone looks at these funny creatures rather than the product that they are showing.
All in all there is a huge amount that could be done and it would make the anti-smoking lobby credible again.
No I don\'t mind sharing what worked for me with you. Like you I had tried many times over the past 30 years to quit. I can remember so many key points in my life when I made firm committments to quit. One was when my eldest daughter was born I remember, so vividly, looking at her and swearing I would give up the fags. But I didn\'t realise then that I was addicted to nicotine - I just called it a habit, one that I felt I could just give up. I did not understand then that there is a difference. Wanting to give up wasn\'t enough. I think that was why I failed so many times. When I tried with patches and gum etc I felt I was just replacing one form of taking in nicotine with another - a reciepe for disaster.
Well I did I give up in the end? I used an Irish product called NicoBloc. It was so simple you put a drop on the filter of the cigarette befor you smoke it and it traps the nicotine in the filter - well some of it - after a few weeks you put 2 drops on and it then traps more nicotine. I think why it worked for me was that I slowly weaned myself off nicotine without any of the panic of the sudden stop you have to do when you use with patches. I felel it treated my addiction the same way addicts come off drugs - slowly. Anyway after about six weeks I was only smoking a few fags a day any then I would forget to smoke. I know its sounds silly but I found a new confidence in myself, I slowly felt that this was going to be the last time I gave up the fags.
Don\'t get me wrong it took effort but I beat the addiction! I can now play with my grandchildren without them saying \"Grandad please dont smoke\" - like my kids did.
I wish you every success.
I also found another part of your post very interesting but I will come back and make a referance to that because I don't want to be writing too much in one post. Thank you.
Do you mind telling me what worked for you in the end? If it's private, fine, but you sound exactly like me. I've tried EVERYTHING I can think of - cold turkey, patches, laser acupuncture, acupuncture, hypnosis, Alan Carr courses (plural!). So I'd love to know what worked for you in the end. My guess is it was just your time. That's what people tell me: that one time, it just works. I'll never quit quitting! Thanks. Even without your explanation, you've give me hope.
One is, under it all, do they actually WANT to quit(and people who try to tell other people what to want are also people with serious psychological problems)?
The other is, can they afford to make quitting their first priority for a few months, because if they can't (and for most of the average persons life, quitting comes a long way down the list after other, more pressing and immediate stresses and problems to be tackled).
Now I cannot see, for the life of me, how the smoking ban, or any amount of hassle from non-smokers will have the slightest beneficial effect on either.
Incidentally, the Asthmatics in California weren't imagining things. Cigarette smoke is a brochodilator. That is why it is such an efficient drug delivery system, it literally helps you breath better in the short term, so that you can take in the toxins that cause your breathing to deteriorate long term more efficiently.
I am an ex heavy smoker with Emphysema, but I didn't get a personality transplant when I quit, so I remain pro-choice, however, the most effective means I know of motivating people to quit isn't pseudo moralising or berating them, it isn't even heaqlth scare tactics (yep, smoking most certainly can damage your health, but most TV advertising I have seen to that effect is just melodrama, and often the kijnd of stomach churning organic melodrama people zone out at that). It is, very simply, showing them the reality of what they can do with all the money they will go on saving every week for the rest of their lives.
THAT is REAL, for 100% of smokers.
Then one day I found something that worked for me and I quit in only 6 weeks and have never looked back. I think that if you keep trying you will find your way. I read somewhere that half of all smokers in America had quit. So I always felt it was going to be possible for me.
Jessie, your smoking friends will not feel betrayed if you stop smoking. Indeed they will be very happy for you and full of admiration. You see, they understand how difficult it is. I see I've met a kindred spirit who has a difficulty with having prohibition imposed on them and sees it as an obstacle to giving up smoking. The Health Srvice did a good job on educating us about the effects of smoking. Now can they educate us on how to stop. Then there would be no need to ressurect visions of leather-wielding schoolmasters by the heavy-handed use of the blunt instrument of prohibition.
The smoking ban will not help smokers. A reasonable level of help in dealing with our addiction would be much more effective.
If anybody sees this as a whinge or gutless, they do not understand the problem or how to solve it.
No body can give up the habit for you. You have to do it yourself, and if you keep supporting eachother in the habit you are only making it more difficult.
I hope those of you who are trying to kick the weed will suceed. You may still get cancer, as I might but who is to know you may get it 10 years earlier if you continue smoking.
I probably won't even look in on this topic again so fight among yourselves. Good luck.
I also feel that I would be leaving my fellow smokers down if I left right now. Maybe it is too soon or something but I am now very aware of my smoking friends whereas before I wasn't. We just all mixed together. So here again is another type of tug-of-war. Have you noticed this Paddy?