Are parents who allow their young children to become obese behaving negligently?

# 38

Posted: 16/09/2010 09:32

James, I am very glad to see that you accept that many people have medical conditions affecting ther weight - bear in mind also that a direct side effct of certain medications is weight gain. I am glad to see also that you accept that for so many the weight gain is an actual symtom of a problem - not the problem itself and many have agreed, particularly in cases like addiction issues, comfort eating, emotional eating, self-esteem etc.

The truth may be unpleasant but if you cannot get to the root of the problem (rather than the symptom) and particularly if you throw around perjorative terms like lazy and irresponsible instead of actually trying to help, you not only don't solve the problem but you raise enough resentment in people to compound the problem.

# 37

Posted: 15/09/2010 15:10

Anon, Going back to the beginning of our debate, my main point is that a lot of people including yourself seem to want to shy away from the fact that if you choose to eat too much versus the amount of exercise you will be overweight. I have many times accepted that some people have medical issues such as underactive thyroid. I have also accepted many times that for some people there is a mental aspect of addiction issues, self-esteem etc. However I am merely stating the obvious that for significant numbers of overweight people, it is down to not taking responsibility for their health and making the healthy choices, and instead choosing to sit on the couch eating rubbish. For some reason you find it impossible to accept this self-evident fact. Often times the truth is unpleasant, but if you cannot face the truth you cannot solve the problem.

# 36

Posted: 15/09/2010 09:53

No James, you miss the point completely. I am saying that I absolutely cannot be 100% sure as to what extent "laziness" is a factor in each and every individual case and franklu I cannot logically see how you can be 100% sure either unless you know each and every person, their lives, circumstances and backgrounds. I am not saying it is ok for anyone not to take any responsibility that they can for their own actions and their own health but what I am saying is that throwing around perjorative terms is quite the opposite of being helpful

# 35

Posted: 14/09/2010 16:00

Anon, right enough I do not know every single obese person in the world. But I do stick to my assertion that significant amount of overweight people are overweight due to laziness. I think anon, it is a fairly self-evident fact. Are you saying that you are 100% sure that laziness is not a factor in significant amounts of overweight people? I go back to a broader definition of laziness to include mental laziness where people do not make the decisions that they know to be correct (such as choosing to eat more healthily or choose to take a bit more exercise) and about the mental laziness that permits people to opt out of taking responsibility for making the correct choices. Tell me you are 100% sure that this definition of laziness is not a factor. This can be referred to as “enabling” where we allow the other person to harm themselves. You are saying it is ok for the person not to take responsibility for their own actions and their own health.

# 34

Posted: 14/09/2010 12:11

James, given that you do not know all of these people, then how logically, without making judgement calls, could you be 100% sure the the cause is laziness?  Yesm suggesting cookbooks is hardly rocket science and suggesting people proactively go out and get the knowledge is hardly rocket science but some people seem to find it far more difficult than casting aspersions and throwing around perjorative remarks .

# 33

Posted: 27/08/2010 10:47

Anon, I am not making judgements on individual people. But yes I am 100% sure that laziness is a big factor in the case of a significant proportion of overweight people. When I say laziness I am not just talking about physical laziness, but also the mental laziness that avoids taking responsibility to make the healthy choices or to go out and get the information to make the healthy choice. People go out and get the knowledge to work SAT TV or computer games, same applies to healthy eating. Suggesting cookbooks is hardly rocket science. Suggesting people proactively go out and get the knowledge is hardly rocket science. It isn�t rocket science, it is very simple, if you eat too much and do not exercise enough you will become overweight. Most people know that. I know when I have been eating too much crap and not exercising (eg Christmas) I know that I don�t feel great mentally or physically in January. I have a choice in January to get back in the game or I can take the easy option and continue my bad habits from Christmas. It is my responsibility to make that choice. You are absolving people of taking that responsibility.

# 32

Posted: 26/08/2010 20:25

growing up in the 70's and 80's, there were a few, not many, over weight kids, and when I mean over weight, i'm not talking about the chunky kid, i'm talking about the children with dimples for knuckles,  creases for joints, bellies hanging over thier trousers and shortness of breath at any slight activity.

Today take a walk in any town or city and you will see , one or two of these kids usually being towed along by an overwieght parent. and the reason for this, is simple, overeating and inactivity. it's too easy for a child to get into the habit of spending thier waking hours in front of a screen, ethier TV, games consoles or laptops. And laziness on the childs part and the parents part will keep these children there, and condem them to a life of obesity and shorten that life.

So whats to done about it? I honestly don't know, but with other problems the softly softly approach never works, a big stick might wake a few up and financially as well, if you take up two seats you pay for too, if your obese you lose health insurance, a wake up call, not "it's alright, being fat is natural" rubbish.

All I can insure is that I and my familly stay healthy and fit, and give my children a sense of going out side to the beach, the mountains the parks, is fun and staying in looking at screens is a poor second best.

# 31

Posted: 26/08/2010 13:56

So, you know all these people personally, thier lives backgorounds and circumstnaces and therefore know for a fact that that the problem is "laziness"?  Coolboos are a good suggestion as are websites  - safefood.eu is one and there are website links on this site too to sires which give advice on halthy eating and cooking.  Potoatoes and beans is a good siggestion. Breakfast cereal and some fruit o9s naote rgood suggestion,. It is this type of advice and help we need rather than bandying round perjorative terms which help nobody.It's true lack of knowledge on how to get sat TV working or how to work a computer game doesn’t stop people going out and getting this knowledge, exactly and it is this approach people should take, I believe, to knowledge about something as important as their health. My interest is not in absolving anyone  - that is not my perogative, my interest is in helping people and helping people, to help each other, even in a very small way, if I can.

# 30

Posted: 26/08/2010 10:51

Anon, Yes is the answer, most certainly for a lot of people it is in fact laziness that is the root of the problem. I have repeatedly accepted your point that for many it is deeper mental issues that are at issue. My only point, which you seem to refuse to accept, is that we must not shy away from that fact that for many it is simply laziness. Nobody truly believes that a diet of burger and chips is healthy. Therefore if we don’t have underlying mental issues, we then make a decision to eat them or not. Some of us make the decision to eat them as a treat once a month; others make them a mainstay of their diet. Of course not everyone is good at cooking, but it is in fact laziness in many cases that stops a person picking an appropriate cookbook to help them. How much time or expertise does it take to boil a few spuds and heat a tin of baked beans; yet this simple meal is relatively healthy and nutritious and tasty enough if you like the more fast food type taste. Add a healthy(ish) breakfast cereal and some fruit and you are half way to a decent healthy diet already. I agree that lack of knowledge may be part of the issue, yet lack of knowledge in how to get sat TV working or how to work a computer game doesn’t stop people going out and getting this knowledge. We as individuals have a responsibility to ourselves and you seem happy to absolve us of that responsibility and blame our problems on factors outside of ourselves.

# 29

Posted: 24/08/2010 15:36

IS it laziness for a lot of people? I don't know because I don't know them. Do you? To tackle a problem we must look at underlying causes - why do people make poor choices? Is it lack of information, lack of access, lack of resources or another problem?

After a long day both the body and the mind will feel much better after a 20 min walk in the fresh air and a healthy meal, compared to a feed of chips and burgers in front of the TV. Absolutely agreed. This is the kind of advice and information we need. Just becuasre you and I know this, we can';t presume others do as well. Time organisation can be another factor when it comes to cooking simple meals from fresh ingedients.

For some they cannot do anything about the problem on their own - you know the expression, 'no man is an island.' Where obesity is a symptom (and it often is) frequently help will be needed to get the root cause of the problem and befofre someone can get help, they must be aware that help ius needed and is available.

# 28

Posted: 24/08/2010 13:43

Anon, I am not denying that a lot of people have mental issues that are core to their problem and I agree with you on that. All I am saying is that we also have to accept that for a lot of people it is in fact laziness or making poor choices and not taking responsibility for these choices. Re feeling exhausted, the expression “energy breeds energy” can be very true. After a long day both the body and the mind will feel much better after a 20 min walk in the fresh air and a healthy meal, compared to a feed of chips and burgers in front of the TV. As humans we have a responsibility to recognise that we can do something about the problem and make the choices; it is laziness of another kind that takes this responsibility from us and says that we cannot do anything about the problem on our own. We should not be trying to minimise the responsibility that we ourselves as individuals have, while also accepting that for some people (but nowhere near all people) the problem is in fact bigger than that.

# 27

Posted: 23/08/2010 14:06

Obesity is a symptom James. Even in the U.S. where the problem is much greater, ACE freely admits that the problem of undersiagnosis of endocrinolgical disorder is far far higher than estimated. Not only comfort eating, low-self esteem and poor education are underlying causes but alos mental health issues and unless you tackle the underlying problems you'll never solve the symtoims - that of obesity being one. Tossing around perjorative comments such as "pure laziness" is in itself laziness or unwillingness to investigate the underlying causes. How do you know those whom you see sittinf around watching TV or sitting in the pub do so solely becase they are laxy? How do you know they aren't simply exhasted after a 50 hour working week and 400 miles weekly commute. How do you know they don't have an underlying endocrinologival condition, or a mental health issue? No amount of evercise will change that. Or aren't simply uneduated on the subject.

# 26

Posted: 23/08/2010 12:14

I am sorry Anon, but the obesity problem that we are facing has little to do with underdiagnosis or thyroid or adrenal conditions or side-effects of medication; these cases will only be a small percentage of the overall problem. I agree that comfort eating, low-self esteem and poor education can be contributory factors in a lot of cases. Sometimes in a lot of cases it is pure laziness, with a preference to sit in the pub drinking, or sit on the couch watching TV. The point is that these contributory factors lead to an inbalance between exercise and calorie intake. There is a responsibility on all of us to take ownership of our part in any problem. I have a choice between eating burgers and chips and a more healthy dinner. I have a choice between getting the lift and even walking one or two flights of stairs. I know that mentally I always feel better when I have been exercising regularly and eating well, and I know that I feel down when I go through periods of indulgence and low amts of exercise. (Classically this would manifest as the January blues after Christmas). These are all choices that contribute to how I feel about myself and my self-esteem. My self-esteem is always better when I am fit and healthy and I have a choice in making this happen. But the bottom line is that my weight is determined by the balance between exercise and calories; trying to avoid this is just that; avoiding the issue and minimizing our responsibility to the control of the problem.

# 25

Posted: 20/08/2010 15:41

Nothing at all to do with political correctnbess but simply knowing that rducing the problem to "exercise and calories not matching" is a vast oversimplification of the problem, as most enlightened medical professionals agree.Obesity is a symtom which cannot be reslved without tacklign the root cuases, which you yourself mentioned James - mental HEALTH issues, the contribution of certain medicaton whch are a known factor in the cuase of obesity, the vast undserdiagnoses of thyroid and adrenal conditions, behaviours such as comfort eating and addiuction which can ply be resolved by treatment, including counselling, low self-esteem and poor education.

# 24

Posted: 20/08/2010 13:40

A lot of people for political correctness reasons seem shy of stating a simple basic fact. At its root, the cause of any weight problem is the simple maths of exercise and calories not matching. There are of course many contributory factors such as mental issues, self-esteem, poor education, addiction-type issuesetc. But all the contributory factors then cause the calorie intake to exceed the exercise taken. Please don't shy away from the truth; it doesn't help either.

# 23

Posted: 03/08/2010 16:18

I was very lucky my children were never obese but it was constant hard work on my part as my husband is a compulsive over-eater. Role models etc.... so it depends on the situation.

# 22

Posted: 26/07/2010 12:38

Excellent points Contance, a good common sense view of what is a complex  situation, in contrast to a lot of the unhelpful simplification put about here.

# 21

Posted: 26/07/2010 07:01

although I agree that parents are negligent when they allow their children to become obese I think they are also victims of circumstances. Huge budgets are invested in marketing unhealthy food to families and children and health services are not available to help people when there are problems. Ultimately a huge burden is placed on parents in some cases where there is a child who overeats. I don't think that parents are to blame but parents can end up being negligent because they can't cope and the professional services are not available. I think that children's rights should be protected by the state.

# 20

Posted: 23/07/2010 20:36

I agree with many points that were constructive here and offered good advice. However, another point is that not only are parents the providers and enablers of a poor diet in their children, they also are the reason for inactive children who dont exercise. This is true when the obese kids have inactive parents. I dont see too many obese children with athletic parents. Parents buy these developmentally stunting computer games. The kids and teenagers sit in their rooms for hours on end, chowing down junk food as they sit dormant. The intake of calories mounts up very quickly. Why dont the parents become actively involved with their kids, by being active with them! Of course, its easy to just buy the stupid games and leave them too it so mom can watch her soaps and dad can lounge around, forgetting that good parenting is hands on not hands off, with family members dotted around the house doing 'what they want'. Laziness breaths laziness and im afraid its a case of monkey see, monkey do. Get off your backsides and get your children active and healthy. They are the parents  responsibility but thats gets forgotten when its convenient.

# 19

Posted: 23/07/2010 20:02

Obesity is not all about food and getting more exercise, although these are important - it could be a poverty issue, a health issue, a genetic issue etc. - for example, look at the foods the supermarkets reduce prices on or sell cheaper - yea - the high sugar content foods that look like good choices such as the cheaper yogurts that use more refined sugar than fruit sugars to provide taste etc. - the 'low' fat foods that again use sugar to give taste - having to stretch the budget with several children to feed etc. can be problematic for many families - the cheaper the food the more likelihood of higher consumption even for some families who genuinely care for their children and their health- especially the high carbs - bread, rice, potato etc. where the child will feel satisfied at a lower cost- obesity can be a side effect of required medications, a side effect of a health problem such as hypothyroidism and with all the assumptions that overweight is a problem of bad parenting we may be doing an injustice to people dealing with multiple other issues - yes there are children who are not given a balanced diet but they are not the only ones that are overweight - it depends on the circumstances and yes there are some parents who believe that a happy child is a well fed child and it may be difficult for such parents change their perception of good parenting being equated with rosy chubby cheeks!

# 18

Posted: 21/07/2010 14:58

Oh yes I agree, but I am just amking the point that lack of education should not be used as an excuse. How do we know these people were NOT told the same things as my parents but decided to ignore the advice? We cannot say they make bad food choices because they werent educated. Like I said, I know people who werent educated but who still chose to feed their families well.

# 17

Posted: 21/07/2010 14:58

Oh yes I agree, but I am just making the point that lack of education should not be used as an excuse. How do we know these people were NOT told the same things as my parents but decided to ignore the advice? We cannot say they make bad food choices because they werent educated. Like I said, I know people who werent educated but who still chose to feed their families well.

# 16

Posted: 21/07/2010 13:54

Maybe you have a ppomt Buzz but your parents learned about diet and nutrition from somewhere - maybe from their own parents and without information you cannot expect people to make good choices.

Perhaps nutrition should be taught in schools again.

# 15

Posted: 21/07/2010 12:06

I dont think we can blame everything on a lack of education. My parents were not particularly well educated but we were always given proper food as children.

Lack of education is used far too often as a get out of jail free card for those who wish to make bad choices. This is of little use to the children who will suffer early onset diabetes as a result of their horrendous diets.

# 14

Posted: 21/07/2010 09:46

Well Buzz, in the case of mothers going about in their pyjamas - this is certainly a new trend and perhaps it is lack of education that is at fault there in terms of their nutritional choices. The poster who mentioned turning off the TV had an excellent point too. We turn it on only to watch something specific - not as mindless 'chewing gum for the eyes'.  An excellent post Michael, you show actual insight instead of being judegemental as others are and you provide good suggestions as well.

# 13

Posted: 20/07/2010 21:09

Of course it is the parent's fault two generations ago, but it started in my age group as a parent who went through tough times and little food. So it made us feel good when we were able to give our children more than we got as we had more money than our parent's had. At that time we did not know the consequences it would have on our children or our grand children then as there was very little or no advice given to my generation as to what this might lead to in the future. of course now there is leaflets etc. and the media, (plus the people and friends)who make remarks as to there weight. This can lead to mental problems as much as phyical brake up relations etc. I am sorry for those parents of to day as it was as much our fault as theirs.They chould be incouraged instead of belittled, and talked about as it will always come back to them, I could not imagin how that would affect them.There must be a way of teaching them how, what,when, our grand parents used to eat(bring back the cook books)and teach them at schools, and evening classes for the adults of to day, would be a start!

I am now a Qualified Practitioner in Clinical Hypnotherapy.Also a Qualified Colour Therapist,Pain control therapist. and studying Cognitive Behavioral Therapy, that now marries with Hypnotherapy. Doctors are finding it very hard and time consuming to get the growing number of Patients off the drugs that were giving to help with an ailment for a certain period of time and the patient's keep returning for more scripts.This does not help the Doctor's or patients, and as I have a great amount of experience of how hard it can be to stop taking the medication, when warned by the Doctor's, and that is why I have studied hard and hold a Dip.in pain control, to be of help to others, as I have to myself "Addiction to prescribed medication" I have found is far easier to stop Prescribed drugs than stopping cigarettes,I never believed this until I studied and found I could get off class A drugs with a few days of self help,even codeine tabs that I was taking, prescribed, and over the counter as I found I needed more all the time(addiction) for years I stopped taking A Doctor will always reduce your med's over a certain time which is the correct way of stopping, but if you find that you need higher dose's,and your Doctor advice is to cut down?Take action, as your Doctor has very good reason to advice this "as I found out",and I have my own mind back again.Although I lost 20yrs.of living,working,and very bad memory loss,I have control of all my aches and pains.This does not mean I don't have pain,it means I have the control and not the medication! You are not alone there is help, just ask!!! Yours, Michael A.H

# 12

Posted: 20/07/2010 19:38

Mother of five, ages from 10 to 19. If your child is overweight it's the parents fault...NOT the child...WAKEUP irish parent and stop giving your kids JUNK food and please turn off the t.v...Get out and start MOVING parents!!!!!!!!!!!

# 11

Posted: 20/07/2010 17:59

Anna, I don;t go to Deli's as a rule so I am not aware of the queues but I do nknow a hell of a loty of exhausted parents.  Now unless Mollyboo prsonaly knows all about the the lives of those parents then niether she nor you have any business judging them. 

# 10

Posted: 20/07/2010 14:59

I dont know...I've seen people in my area feeding their kinds up on deli fats and they are not exactly rushed off their feet. They tend to plod down to the shop still in half their pyjamas and order their sausage rolls and er.."Johnny Blue"!!

These people seem to think instant noodles are nutritionally appropriate as a main meal...

# 9

Posted: 20/07/2010 12:39

I believe children usually reflect lifestyle of their parents. I don't know many sporty parents that would have obese children..

# 8

Posted: 20/07/2010 10:47

Anonymous - you could make a sandwich yourself in the time it takes to queue up at a deli and have one made for you. I have two young children and work and am tired a hell of a lot of the time, but I don't feed my kids garbage. What Mollyboo describes is sheer lazyness on the part of the parents.

# 7

Posted: 20/07/2010 09:43

Mollyboo, maybe what you should ask yourself, is  - if you had to get by on 5 - 6 hours sleep per night, Max, commute 2+ hours per day, work an average 9 hour day, manange a home and still have some semblance of a relationship with your parther and do your share of caring for an elderly parent, would you have sufficient energy to think about making sandwiches or would you be too exhausted? Becuase this is the reality for many parents.

Maybe they don't know how damaging fatty sausage rolls etc are or maybe they are just too dog-tired for an argument. Perhaps in the case of the child you mentioned, his mother doesn't realise he's obese because perhaps she doesnt realise she is obese because maybe she was not educated about it but do you think judgementalism as you happily sell the food you percieve will make them worse, actually helps?  

# 6

Posted: 19/07/2010 16:57

I work in a deli in a supermarket. We sell typical deli fare: sausage rolls, pies etc. On a typical school morning, parents bring thier kids in and allow the kid to choose what they want for breakfast and school lunch. Do these parents not know how to make a sandwich? Or do they know how damaging fatty sausage rolls etc are? Or could they just not be bothered any more??? Do parents not know how to say no to their kids? One particular child coming into the shop is about 9 or 10, he is obese but his equally obese mother continually buys fatty junk food for him and happily packs him off to school. Parents need to wake up and become more food savvy.

# 5

Posted: 19/07/2010 14:05

Good point anon. The first time I read a BMI chart I was shocked!

That said, I think the pint made was about those who are (probably) super morbid obese ie the ones who are obviously obese and whose BMI goes over the 40 mark. I too, do not understand why these people did not act sooner. Then again, I don't want to tar everyone with the same brush.

# 4

Posted: 19/07/2010 10:27

i.know.im.good has a point, lack of resources to buy fresh healthy food are part of the problem as is lack of education, but the comment "My fascination with obese people is why they dont stop earlier, why they let the problem get so out of hand that its nearly impossible to lose the weight because they get so physically large that exercise is impossible" betrays ignorance. In reality, the threshold for obese is so low many people don't realise it and in fact, the majority of obese people are not in fact too large to exercise or lose weight.

# 3

Posted: 17/07/2010 20:28

Until a certain age, a child only eats what is put on their plates by their parents. Parents do the shopping and make the food choices for their kids. Their vital role in teaching children correct food habits from a very early age often isnt realised until it is too late. A childs 'taste' for bad 'cardiogenic' food, comes from their parents habits and very often its a case of history repeating itself. Obese children from obese parents. Primarily, its a lack of education or inadequate finances to buy good, fresh food. Jamie Olivers campaign in the UK highlighted the magnitude of the problem and the difficulties he faced to get people thinking what children put in their stomach whilst at school etc. Portion size is a massive problem and the variety of snacks available for children is vast. Their is also a huge misrepresentation of nutritional content in foods, driven by the food industry. People are also not informed what 'fuel' their bodies require on a daily basis and overeat to obesity. My fascination with obese people is why they dont stop earlier, why they let the problem get so out of hand that its nearly impossible to lose the weight because they get so physically large that exercise is impossible. Food addiction and comfort is a major part of the problem and boredom in peoples lives. People who are physically active dont lounge around as they are busy being active and enjoy being active. Overweight people are home more and inactive more so have more time to eat and hence get into a viscious cycle. How many overweight people say i hate exercise, alot. Thats the problem in a nutshell- eat less, move more. My observations are from having a family member lose 6 stone so where there is a will, there is a way. People just need to decide whats important, food or life.

# 2

Posted: 17/07/2010 16:55

Those parents usually allow their children to eat constantly fast foods,and drinking coke ext. Such unhealthy foods result in overweight.

Dr.Hermon Mihranian

# 1

Posted: 16/07/2010 22:27

there are other areas in which far too many parents are remiss,in short there is no such thing as a bad child, just bad parents. 

simon cullen